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Post by Minnibella on May 25, 2008 21:23:13 GMT -5
One of my beloved mentors is getting a group of my close friends( which also include some other close mentors, friends, etc.) to come on this weekend to clean and declutter my apartment. My mentor also told me to get 2 weeks of clothes out and she was taking them to the cleaners. She also does not want me to be there while they are cleaning. Now I am having high anxiety of people coming into my home. Most of these people know a little about my depression, and some know of my squalor; and a couple have even helped in the past. My mentor who is a trusted confidante, says that I need rescuing and that sometimes people need for others to come to their rescue and that sometimes we do not have the ability to help ourselves and do things by ourselves. Why is my anxiety a mile high??!!! ?
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Post by moggyfan on May 25, 2008 21:34:36 GMT -5
I am sure your friends' intentions are all good. But I would still be very hesitant to accept the offer with the conditions set forth.
It is great that people want to help you, but why should you not be present, and, in fact, direct the effort?
#1 I think you should have control over what is disposed of #2 I think you need to have ownership of the "desqualoring" process (I had [hired] help at the beginning, but it was extremely important that I agreed to dispose of things, rather than have someone else make the decision. And, it was ***my*** mess; it was important that I be a major part of cleaning it up).
I think your "mile-high" anxiety is telling you something important. Welcome the offer and appreciate the sincerity with which it is made, but you need to be comfortable with the process. You are not helpless; you are not a child. You're an adult who wants to get her home clean--be a part of it.
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Post by heylady1 on May 25, 2008 21:48:21 GMT -5
I agree totally with Moggyfan! I mean, how are these people to know what's important to you? There is no way in 'heck' I'd let someone go through my closets and dispose of what they deem unimportant....they could throw away some of my son's artwork from when he was a little kid (I didn't keep everything he did, but what I did keep is special to me).....or maybe they'd throw away clothes that actually fit me as opposed to the ones that no longer do!!!
Do you even want their help at this time?
Sounds like you are being pushed into this. Please don't think I'm putting down your friends though, I'm sure their hearts are in the right place!!
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Post by BDG on May 25, 2008 21:57:48 GMT -5
I say go for it and let your mentor rescue you, depression is a horrible beast and clean surroundings will probably make you feel better. Your anxiety is high because someone will be coming inot your space and cleaning and because all of this is about change, even good change is stressful, unless it's the kind that jingles.
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Post by artsygal on May 25, 2008 22:07:58 GMT -5
Hey minnibella,
You know know that I've had help twice now in 2 weeks, first with a friend and acquaintance, then yesterday with hired help. I agree with moggyfan, accept the help but only if your present. It's your stuff and you need to feel like you can have some control. I would suggest you explain your ideas and feelings with your friend and tell them that it's very beneficial that you are present. It was for me. I had to face my problem head on rather then just coming back to a clean house. I just had my friends bag up the garbage (which was a lot ) and the basement was too unsanitary to do, but I've been the one cleaning an reorganizing, that has been a huge difference. We're here to learn about getting rid of and then maintaining a squalor free life in steps. I would have a good conversation with your friend, they're obviously there for you, and let them know that you need to be present. No matter what, your'e going to anxious, I was. But the feeling of not hiding anymore and asking for help is very impowering. Let me know how it's going.
(((HUGS)))) artsy
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Post by onwardandupward on May 25, 2008 23:23:38 GMT -5
While I do understand how loving friends are concerned and want to fix things for you, I agree with the others who have said that this does not seem to be a good solution for you.
I would not consider allowing anyone to determine what goes or stays. And while it seems on the surface that being gone would be a way to avoid direct embarassment, I couldn't allow that to happen in my case.
Having help who are there to FOLLOW YOUR DIRECTIONS would be useful. Having them help you do what YOU want to get done in the order and manner YOU choose...now that sounds like a plan.
If YOU are not in control of the cleanup, I doubt it will last. But if you do the work, or direct the work being done, I believe you can make true progress. But of course, this is just my opinion, and based on my own issues. Your situation may very well be different.
Bottom line - follow your instincts. I believe that deep down, you know what is right for you. Stay true to yourself and things will work out fine.
Onward
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Post by Rennie Ellen on May 26, 2008 3:03:25 GMT -5
Minnibella,
I agree with everyone else....you need to be there while they're cleaning and decluttering.
My friends helped me yet *I* was the one in control. *I* decided what got tossed, what was kept and what was going to the thrift store. It gave me ownership in that I was directing the whole thing when I couldn't do it all by myself physically. Plus you know what's getting tossed and what's getting donated and what's staying. I appreciated their feedback because they had some wonderful ideas, but in the end, *I* was the one who made the ultimate decision.
You're feeling anxiety because you have a "gut feeling" telling you you're not comfortable with your mentor's arrangement. I might not have been able to get my home decluttered without the help of my friends, but they went out of their way to make me feel that I was still in control of things at a time when I felt like circumstances were totally out of control in my life. (I had to move to a smaller apartment because my daughter moved out prematurely -- ran away -- at the age of 17.) Tell her they can come clean but you have to be there too. It's your home and you have a right to be there while they're cleaning.
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Post by eagle on May 26, 2008 8:33:45 GMT -5
My concern over having no part in the decision making process would be that I would later resent the people and blame them everytime I couldn't find something I needed, such as a treasured letter from my deceased mother or my passport, or what not.
The other concern would be that by having no part in the actual de-squaloring process, I would not 'own' it and therefore not feel the pride of ownership. There is so much to learn from the process and it is a part of the growth and development that can lead to becoming more capable of maintaining our own homes. By being involved in the process, we can 'own' the decisions we made for disposal or retaining certain items. We can mentally process things more easily if we are there during the clean-up. This is very hard to do if we have no say whatsoever in what happens to our stuff.
Have you ever been robbed? I have and it feels like a personal violation. I have read and heard other squalorees describe the way they felt when others cleaned up their homes without their permission and the feelings they described were very much the way I felt when my home (and another time, my car) was broken into and things were stolen.
Even if you give them permission to clean it up in your absence, I believe you are opening yourself up to these same feelings of being violated and robbed. It's okay to say, 'No, I'm just not ready to give over all of my decision-making regarding my stuff right now.' It's entirely possible that your friend/mentor will understand and accept your decision to be present and participate in the process. If not, then we are here for you and we can work together in chat and on ListZilla or whereever.
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Post by Script on May 26, 2008 8:40:13 GMT -5
My mentor who is a trusted confidante, says that I need rescuing and that sometimes people need for others to come to their rescue and that sometimes we do not have the ability to help ourselves and do things by ourselves. Logically speaking if you allow this group to help you, one of two things will happen: *you will be rescued *you will not be rescued If you are rescued, you can then: *proceed on your own merry way and learn maintenance and routines and healthy choices If you are not rescued and eventually return to squalor, you can then: *keep on doing what you have been doing, it is your choice. Obviously you trust this mentor; you call him/her BELOVED. You have discussed enough of your situation to inspire your friends to help you. I do not agree with the posters who say you should be there to 'supervise'. BEING THERE: you are there ALL THE TIME and it has not helped 'rescue' you. I bet anything that EVERYTHING in your house is valuable and not valuable. The great paradox of squalor: too valuable to toss, but not valuable enough to care for appropriately. I loved my books. So much so that I never parted with any of them. Not enough to dust or care for them. Now that I have 'done' my library, I wish that a cleaning fairy had come in with a magic wand and SWOOSH, simply removed them. It took me 20 hours of intense work to CLEAN and toss and arrange. This to me is a HUGE amount of time. I have been involved (in various capacities over the years) with mental-health self-help support groups. There are people who believe in interventions; people who do not. At some level, you must have believed that they could help you: otherwise, why did you share your story? I say: take a Xanax and GO FOR IT! You can always re-clutter later if you are uneasy with the tidiness.
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Post by onwardandupward on May 26, 2008 9:11:14 GMT -5
Script,
I always love your responses...they are food for thought.
For me, I wouldn't be ready to let go of control, but perhaps it is because I don't have a "beloved mentor," and outside of this group, only one other person is aware of my issue, and even though she is a dear friend, she is not someone I would allow to intervene without my input.
Your point regarding the trust in a "beloved mentor" is well taken. That type of intervention could very well be a catalyst for change. After all, my new avatar and message were chosen to make the point that most people could benefit from help. I was referring to the help I have received from the group members here (and SS), but truly, as long as one is open to the help, it shouldn't matter what form it takes.
Thanks for presenting another view and opening up my mind a bit.
Onward
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Post by crazycatlady on May 26, 2008 16:49:23 GMT -5
I helped do a mini-dig out of a friend. Two of us helped declutter/desqualor, while she directed us on what could stay or go. We confronted her on some things (like why did she have a million pairs of undies), and she pushed back. Over the period of one morning, we made a good dent and she reports that she continues to clean.
I would be very uncomfortable with not being around as they decluttered you. However, as Script said, you do trust your friend, and it certainly would move you forward quickly!
I did once declutter paper for my Dad. He was home, but for the most part I simply went through piles and piles and piles and threw all kinds of stuff away, while sorting and saving a little bit. I got some input from him occasionally, but for the most part could figure it out on my own. And...I found a LOT of uncashed checks that we were able to cash. If he and I had sat down to go through each bit of paper, it would have taken months. As it was, I got through it in a few days.
Sometimes it really does help to have a team approach. Talk to your friend about why you would not be there. And find out what they will do with questionable things...keep it for you to sort later?
Best of luck...you have true friends who sound like they really want to help!
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angelbec
New Member
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 7
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Post by angelbec on May 27, 2008 13:40:45 GMT -5
We care about what others think - plain and simple .. and for those that don't understand our issues we feel that we will be judged.
I had a "friend" help me move once - and he went back home and went into great detail with his wife about the state of my apartment.
She in turn sent me an email talking about how I shouldn't give people the impression that I was "dirty"
After having to explain to her my depression, bi-polar and recovery from a nervous breakdown, plus being raised by a mentally ill mother ... she felt badly.
The point that I am trying to make is be careful who you let into your house to "help" you. It is great that someone wants to do that - just be emotionally prepared to deal with the aftermath.
Hopefully there will not be one... I will keep you in my thoughts and prayers that it goes well.
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Post by glowworm on May 27, 2008 21:19:42 GMT -5
Sometimes I think it's good to let someone else make the decluttering decisions.
When I first started this little adventure, I had a trusted friend come in and help me with one particularly bad room in my house. We worked together, sorting through it all quickly and ruthlessly. For the most part, I did OK with being more of a help than a hindrance in the decluttering process. But there were some boxes that contained things that I just couldn't deal with. What I really needed was for someone else to look at my stuff with a fresh perspective and decide for me whether it was worth taking up precious space in my house. So we decided that my friend would go through those boxes on her own, while I worked on another part of the room.
This worked out really well for me. I have never ever missed what she threw out.
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Post by Minnibella on May 27, 2008 23:55:13 GMT -5
Greetings, Thanks for all the feedback. I really needed some wise counsel on some things. First of all, my mentor is someone whom I love and trust. Script, thanks for mentioning that...because if it was anybody else, I would not even thought twice about it before I said no to the offer. My mentor has stated that i could be there, but she is afraid that I would be more of a hindrance if I was to be able to say what goes or what stays...and she is probably right, I would want to keep everything. She has offered for me to get the things that I absolutely do not want tossed, or people going through-to put them in a box and no one will touch those things. Gloworm made me think about some things also, I will probably not even missed some things,...I once had to do a mad dash cleanathon and did not have time to really sort and trashes many items...I never even missed what I tossed....I wonder why that was? BDG, depression is a horrible beast and my squalor is at its worse...and someone sees the desperation of my situation...By the way, these are people from my church- whom I respect alot. Yeah, I will still have anxiety when they do come, yet apart of me will breathe a sigh of relief. I am tired of trying to do this by myself. I am tired of trying to protect my pride, shame, or whatever I may be feeling. Truth be told- if there was any aftermath to this and people talked...I am to the point I don't care... I want freedom at any cost!!! Then I can truly be able to offer it to someone else and stand in the murk and mire of their horrific situations. I am tired of my squalor costing me time, money, productivity, and energy. I am tired of not being able to not find things, I am tired of my house stinking, I am tired of squalor affecting my hygiene, I am tired of not being able to cook and eat in my own home, I am tired of not being able to do office or school work at home because of the clutter in my own brain...just tired! i want to open my home to friends, I want to invite a guy I like over for dinner, I want to be able to have a girls slumber party for the young girls I mentor...I want to be able to feel and look like the diva I am ( I am not vain, I am an attractive young woman and I want to be able to present that )...Can anyone relate? Yeah-anxiety is high, but so is HOPE. Does this make any sense? ?? Goodness, someone please talk to me. Shalom.
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Post by BDG on May 28, 2008 2:04:18 GMT -5
Well as I have struggled with that beast depression myself I can so relate, it is not easy to even get up some days, much less tackle the mess in ones home. I myself am barely functioning right now due to my thyroid issues, so believe me I would happily accept help if it was offered by someone I trust.
I'm way past young age but I do so remember , there is nothing wrong with with the things you want and you should have them.
I think it is a good plan to have the box for your special stuff that no one will touch. I also think it would be a good idea for you to enlist the help of someone to help you sort your papers, hopefully most of these people will not even consider throwing anything away unless they are 100% sure it is junk so you will probably end up with a pile of papers.
Also while I know you are depressed and sometimes coming up with a plan of action to make sure that in a month or two things don't slide back, is difficult to do alone especially when depressed and it is easy to get overwhelmed when one is functioning with depression, so enlist help in creating a plan of action to prevent your home from becoming messy again. Make sure it is simple and tackles the everyday requirements and breaks them down to where they can be done over a period of a week. Good Luck!
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