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Post by skitter on Nov 22, 2008 6:51:37 GMT -5
Hi Halfdozen,
You've come to the right spot. People here are very supportive and have lots of experience in different approaches to getting rid of clutter.
I'd start by not bringing anything else into the house. I'm thinking that perhaps easy access to money is making impulsive purchases an almost subconscious thing. If you don't go shopping, can someone else do the necessary shopping, such as for milk and fresh fruit for you?
Could your adult children come and take it over as a project, perhaps in exchange for some things that they need for their apartments? Even if they are cluttery themselves they may be able to help you, just as you have been able to help others. They can also help you see what is important from a child's point of view.
Is there any medical help that you could get? Or a counselling program? It sounds as though impulse control is a big factor for you, I'm wondering whether there is a medication or therapy to help with that.
With regard to your boyfriend, it is understandable that he would feel irritated at the chaos. However, that doesn't mean that he has the right to be angry or abusive toward you or especially toward your children.
Like the rest of us, you've made errors in judgement, but do not feel that you deserve to be yelled at.
With regard to your many fresh starts, I know how you feel. The hardest thing is not being able to trust ourselves. I'm still working on that too.
Hugs and cheers, skitter
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Post by heylady1 on Nov 22, 2008 9:22:28 GMT -5
Welcome Halfadozen!! You've come to the right place! My name is Barb and I am a recovering hoarder. I used to have excess things in my closets, sheds, back porch, etc...but I am slowly learning to let go and change my patterns. One of the things that helped me the most was asking myself these 2 questions before I buy something: Do I really need this? Where am I going to put this? Just taking that moment is enough to stop me in my tracks. The other mindset I'm learning to overcome is letting go of the things I already have but don't use. Example was an iMac computer in my bedroom closet. Nice computer but outdated. I kept it because I kept thinking that if the computer I use now were to die, I'd have that one to fall back on. BUT, the old computer has a flaw in that it can only be upgraded to a certain point and that's it. As my son had pointed out, pretty soon that computer would be worthless because it won't be able to even view half the stuff on the internet. So he reinstalled the OS, I cleaned it up and sold it! My point is that if you aren't ever going to use it, how valuable can it really be to you? If it will become so outdated as to be useless how much are you really going to need it or want it? Isn't your living space worth so much more for you to live in rather than as a storage space for the stuff you will never use?? BTW, I agree with Skitter, your boyfriend shouldn't be taking his anger out on you and especially not your children!! I can understand his frustration but it isn't going to help matters at all.... Now I'm going to ask a difficult question and you certainly don't have to answer but....if your boyfriend were to help you clean out a room, just one room, would that make you freak out? Would it be overwhelming for you to lose the stuff from that one room? (I'm thinking bathroom or perhaps kitchen) Sometimes having someone who isn't as attached to the items to help you can be a great boost, a great motivator to get rid of things that are just sitting around taking up space.
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Blackswan
Banned
Joined: October 2008
Posts: 6,388
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Post by Blackswan on Nov 22, 2008 12:55:43 GMT -5
I have a great idea to get rid of some of your kitchen food clutter. Thanksgiving is coming up, how about taking it to a shelter and knowing that some people are getting wonderful nourishment from it, instead of it just sitting in your kitchen, taking up space?
I am the same way, I have cupboards full of food, and I always eat out, so it never gets eaten. I may take my own advice on this one!
As far as desqualoring goes, the idea is just maintainence. Choose one small area, maybe a tabletop, or a corner of a room, whatever seems doable, and just guard that area with your life! Clean it and don't let anything out of place get in there. It sounds so simple, and i never believed that would work, but after many, many entire house cleanings that led back to third degree squalor, I realized that was the secret, and now I am mostly squalor free! I can easily picture you getting that degree and helping others out of the mess you are in! Take time, read the board, go to squalorsurvivors.com, and really try and understand why your situation is what it is, the desqualoring will come gradually, don't put too much pressure on yourself to do it all TODAY. I found that if I read the board everyday, squalor was at the front of my mind, and it really helped me to fix my house.
Welcome!
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Blue
New Member
Joined: November 2008
Posts: 92
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Post by Blue on Nov 22, 2008 14:02:17 GMT -5
Thank you for all your suggestions. I don't have a lot of money, the things I have were bought second hand at thrift stores, garage sales, etc. or aquired from ads for free things. I joined a freecycle group where things given away every day ! At first, I was picking things up daily, sometimes more than once a day. I have slowed down in getting sutff and I ask myself do I really need it before I reply. Sometimes I will trade something I have for something I want. For years I was on social assistance and I would buy and sell things to make extra money, I was very successful in doing that but as time went on I stopped selling and kept buying. "Robbing Peter to pay Paul". I have OCD and for me its either all or nothing. If I cant do it all I dont do anything. I have been to counselling and have tried various medications but to no avail. When I go to other peoples houses who have clutter I think wow im not the only one, and when they tell me they need help I roll up my sleeves and work with them to declutter; even people I have just met. A friend of mine had troubles with clutter, I suggested she start with one room and keep it clean for as long as it took to become a habit and then move on to the next room keeping it clean plus the room she had already done. Months later her house was spotless and she has been keeping it that way ever since. My career counsellor said I shouldnt worry about getting rid of things I might need because he has total faith that if I need something again I can find it when necessary. All this stuff and so many people in need. I need it too ... emotionally. My boyfriend has tried to help, but i get very anxious when people touch "my stuff" I will go through the garbage to make sure they didnt throw anything important out. This is something I have to beat in order to be clutter free. I have to tackle the stuff and let it go. I have no problems aquiring stuff I just cant let it go.
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Post by notsomessyshell on Nov 22, 2008 15:01:32 GMT -5
Hello and welcome! I have no words of wisdom. Just support and understanding. I am married to a hoarder. Thank you for more insight into his mindset. I am messy. We are quite a pair. This board and the squalorsurvivors.com site have been so helpful in understandingthe why's of my squalor and helping me in getting out of the squalor.
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Blue
New Member
Joined: November 2008
Posts: 92
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Post by Blue on Nov 22, 2008 15:30:27 GMT -5
Hello, and thank you!!... The hardest thing is not being understood, knowing its a problem but not being able to beat it. Sometimes it takes every single ounce of energy I have just to do the dishes, laundry or tidy up a small area and when my bf or family doesnt even notice or they do notice but its not enough, I literally give up. I mean why bother? I clean one spot and the spot I cleaned a few days before is a huge mess again because the kids pull all their toys off the shelves and he leaves his socks on the floor or what have you, everyone is so used to living this way they dont see any reason to keep any area clean. Its hard to explain. My bf thinks the reason we have problems is because of the junk. I have tried over and over to explain that the junk is just a blanket covering all the other issues and there will still be struggles when it is gone. He just doesnt get it !! If doesnt need something he throws it out.. end of story. I do know for some people you cant just walk in and rip their blanket off ( ie: take all their stuff away) without there being repercussions. There is something associated with the stuff : happiness, security, protection, fear could be any number of things. There is shame in people finding out a persons "secret", if people knew ( i mean if they really knew) they might think less of the hoarder. I tell people that I have huge amounts of clutter, I dont think they understand what I mean by HUGE, I tell them to envision and Bugs Bunny cartoon with stuff spilling out of every crack and opening of a house and bugs jumping on the roof to keep it all in.
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Post by messymimi on Nov 22, 2008 19:44:03 GMT -5
Welcome, halfad0zen !
Yes, people here understand.
You obviously have a sincere desire to help others as much as you can. Would you be able to turn that in your favor and give a few items away to people you know truly need them? Just being able to give up an item or two and finding out that nothing bad happens might help you be able to give up a few more. You would also be helping others and giving a positive use to those items. Right now they only have a negative use -- making you feel bad, cluttering up your house and mind, leeching off of you.
The idea of cleaning a little place and keeping it that way until the family gets to where they help with it is also good. I got my kitchen sink back by simply gently reminding every one to put dishes in the dishwasher. I would ask, politely, every time I saw dishes in there, "Sweetie, I'm trying to keep the sink clear. Could you put those in the dishwasher for me?" I made them think they were doing me a favor. They did not realize that they were also the benefactors. It is now an almost automatic habit for all of them.
I hope you find what works for you. It's good to have you here.
messymimi
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hopehope
Banned
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 3,815
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Post by hopehope on Nov 22, 2008 20:15:14 GMT -5
yes, I have it too. It is an anxiety disorder. much luck in turning the tide. you are welcome here.
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Blue
New Member
Joined: November 2008
Posts: 92
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Post by Blue on Nov 22, 2008 20:43:28 GMT -5
thank you.. its great to be here, knowing others understand my situation is uplifting
perhaps it is time to give back .. so many have given my family things when we were in need and even when we weren't perhaps its time for me to stop worrying about the value of everything and how much I can get for something and just let it go this stuff costs me precious time ... time i could spend with my family having fun and making new memories
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Post by crazycatlady on Nov 22, 2008 20:58:08 GMT -5
Welcome, Halfad0zen. There are many people here who struggle with similar issues. It must be very tempting when things are inexpensive or free...but maybe you could think of the other people in your area. Maybe they are needing that free item more than you? Or maybe it would help to not even check out the free sites.
Through advice from this community, I started a plan of discarding two items for every one new thing that came into the house. This is a very slow way of getting rid of hoarded items, but in time it works. And it really helped me a lot, because as I looked at the new item, instead of thinking about how much I wanted it, I was thinking about whether or not it was worth giving something else up for!
I'm so glad that you found us. I am certain that you will find support and help here.
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Post by mariposa on Nov 22, 2008 22:42:03 GMT -5
I think I have dealt with something similar to what you've been through. I used to buy way too much stuff. I'd buy so many cheap things on eBay that all those cheap things added up to be a lot of money. I'd buy cans of green beans on sale but I'd keep buying and they weren't being eaten. I'd do emotional shopping. I've kept magazines and papers for years.
I suppose in a way my 3rd degree squalor (cats) has helped. They like to knock over stacks of papers and do their business. So I'd be forced to throw away that pile (eventually...)
I had to not allow myself to go to eBay anymore. I recently threw away all of my magazines. It was hard, but it had to be done. They were doing me no good sitting around, and who knows when I would get around to those projects I wanted them for.
You have to have a "Come to Jesus" moment. I've had a few I guess. I'll get things picked up and then slowly fall off the wagon again. You need to decide whether you want that item more, or do you want a happy home with your children more?
I have never taken anti-depressants or other meds before, although my doctor wanted me to, but perhaps you should try to get another opinion if you think it will help.
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Post by fluffychild on Nov 22, 2008 22:49:36 GMT -5
One of the statements that I make to myself when I am getting rid of things is: Would I run back into a burning house to rescue this item. Another thing that I try to do is get a bag out to Goodwill each day. One year, I went everyday from Labor Day to December 1st when we had a huge snowfall and it was too dangerous to travel. This week, I am 6 out of 7 days. I try to get more out of the house than what I bring in. One of my problems is that I am dealing with three houses that are cluttered - two of them are really bad. I also make a to day list everyday on neon colored loose leaf paper. The colors help me to be able to concentrate.
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Post by Arid on Nov 23, 2008 2:22:37 GMT -5
halfad0zen: You've gotten LOTS of good advice already! One of my favorite self-help books is FEELING GOOD: The New Mood Therapy without Drugs, by Dr. David Burns. One of the points that he makes is that we can "re-frame" our thoughts; we can re-program our brains, and hence, change our behaviors. For example, in reading over your posts, I keep hearing "I can't, I can't, I can't!" You've got to change that "tape" that keeps running in your head. You have to "talk back" to it. Say, "YES, I CAN!!!" Really,--you can. It will take time, practice, perseverance, but you CAN do it. You CAN teach yourself to change your behaviors. You CAN teach yourself to trust that the Good Lord, your neighbors, your family, someone--anyone--in your life will see to it that your needs are met if you can't do it for yourself. You don't have to be prepared for every single "what if" that life may throw at you. You just have to trust that you CAN and you WILL face and handle whatever crisis will come your way. Your current efforts to be prepared and to keep yourself "safe" are having the opposite effect. Also, I can believe that you truly are addicted to the "high" that you get when you find a great bargain or freebie. If you, too, accept that premise--and you've already mentioned it yourself--then, you have to treat it as such. An alcoholic needs to stay out of a bar, and you need to stay out of thrift stores, rummage sales, freecycle, etc. You are going to have to figure out some other activity that will give you pleasure and satisfaction. You just have to make sure that the activity is legal, moral, and not going to cause still other problems! !!! I've had to take this route myself. When we were first married, my DH and I used to go to estate sales, garage sale, rummage sales, flea markets, etc. EVERY WEEKEND. We'd get the newspaper, and we'd map out our route and strategy of attack as if it were a military campaign! I'd go to thrift stores in between times. We ended up with an entire household of goods for about 25% of what the items would have cost new. However, the day came when we had to admit to ourselves that it was TIME TO STOP!!!! Now, had I been the kind of person who can throw things away easily, I wouldn't have had to stop that behavior. However, I find it very, very, (did I mention VERY?!!!) difficult to let go of anything that comes into my hot, little hands. Therefore, I HAD to quit the acquiring. I now take a different approach to shopping. I DO NOT shop for entertainment, socialization, or for any kind of "high" any longer. I do my best to limit my buying to those things that I really, truly NEED--as in, I'm-going-to-USE-this-within-the-next-few-days kind of need. When I do that, I find that I usually don't have any trouble putting the items away once I get them home. They are either used immediately, or there is a space for them in a cupboard, closet, or cabinet because I've used up most of my "inventory" of said items. If you can afford to do the compulsive shopping, then, you can choose to do so--but give EVERYTHING that you purchase to get your "high" away. Give it to a homeless shelter, the Salvation Army, an orphanage, a food pantry, etc. Just be sure that you don't take it all back to your own home! There are plenty of people who could use the items now that the economy is so bad. If you can't afford to keep spending money this way, every time that you get the "urge" (and we know from what you have posted that you get "the urge" daily right now), remind yourself that the money that you are ready to spend on your compulsive shopping could be better used to pay bills, to be saved for a vacation, to be saved for car repairs, to be saved in case of illness, to use for home remodeling, to "splurge" for a nice dinner out for the entire family or for any number of things. Start thinking of ways to benefit the entire family with the money. It doesn't sound like they are benifiting from or enjoying the "fruits" of your compulsive shopping at all these days. They might have enjoyed the new toys and the new-to-them clothing at one time, but I'll bet that if you were to ask them, they'd much rather have a home that has enough cleared space in it that they could invite their friends over for a visit. I posted just a couple of days ago about the struggles that I have with daily maintenance. I'm having to teach myself that I am NOT a failure just because things have to be cleaned up over and over and over again. That's just the nature of the whole "maintenance" thing. Like you, I get frustrated when a recently cleared space get filled up or covered again almost immediately. I'm having to teach myself to "get over it" and to just clean it up all over again! The more often that I do it, the easier and the more automatic it will become. The more often that I clear it off, the more likely it is that others in the family will help to keep it clear, too. They will eventually learn, "Hey! The table is supposed to stay cleared off!" Maybe, you could make a bit of a game of it: You could say, "OK, everybody--we are going to keep this table cleared off. For every day that we keep the table clear, we will put a mark on the calendar (a sticker or star would work great for this!). When we get seven in a row, we will . . .what would they like? a trip to Dairy Queen (don't tell me that it would cost too much--look at how much money you are spending on your compulsive shopping!)? a trip to Chuck E. Cheese? a visit to the library? a trip to the zoo? what??? You know your family members best, so you know what would be a great reward for them. Their happiness will be YOUR reward. The clean table will be YOUR reward. The control that you will gain over the compulsive shopping will be YOUR reward. Those are the things that are "in it" for you. By the way, it is a well-known phenomenon that those of us with our own housekeeping problems can be great little helpers for others with the very same problems. That's because we don't have the same emotional attachments to THEIR items that we have to our OWN. By the same token, it likely would be easier for a cluttered friend to help you to clean your house than it would be for her to clean her own. Some people are lucky enough to have a trusted friend or relative with whom they can work out a schedule where they "trade days" of helping each other clean their homes. Is this a possibility for you? There is so much information that is available here at SOS and at the old SqualorSurvivors sites! Also, there are plenty of other websites where you can read about compulsive hoarding. If you need some of those links, we can point you in the right direction. We always remind people that no one will find every single suggestion or comment helpful, but feel free to "take" what will work for you and to ignore what won't. Also, just because you might not be ready to try a particular suggestion right now doesnt' mean that you might not want to try it further along on your journey out of squalor. I'm really glad that you found this site. I've been to lots and lots of them, and I still think that this community is the very best for helping people turn their houses into the homes that they always have wanted to have. Welcome to the board! Arid
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Post by canna on Nov 23, 2008 9:14:18 GMT -5
HalfadOzen Welcome... You will find that soooo many of us here have been there and of course done that... Remember, be gentle to yourself and try not to beat yourself up about the clutter. You can accomplish a lot, there is plenty of encouragement at this SOS site!
Arid: A really great post. There are so many things I can relate to that you mentioned ESPECIALLY this:
used to go to estate sales, garage sale, rummage sales, flea markets, etc. EVERY WEEKEND. We'd get the newspaper, and we'd map out our route and strategy of attack as if it were a military campaign! I'd go to thrift stores in between times.
Wow. I really had this problem big time. I still visit my favorite thrift stores occasionally, and always try to bring a donation box full of stuff when I go in there to look around. Now, I only buy things I need there. And just "snoop around to look and not buy" also. It was very hard to stop the garagesale estatesale trips, I can understand that "thrill of the shopping" thing very well!
Arid, your post is so understanding, and full of different points and suggestions for everyone to think about! Thank you....
HalfadOzen please keep visiting here, and post as much as you want, vent, complain, etc. Good luck to you and your family as you start your desqualoring. You can do it!! It will take time, a lot of time. There will be progress.....
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Post by Arid on Nov 23, 2008 14:46:53 GMT -5
Thanks so much for your kind words, canna!
I often tend to "get carried away" when I post. I worry sometimes that I might come off sounding like an over-the-top, know-it-all, zealot! I suppose that my defense is that it has taken me years and years of effort to figure a lot of this stuff out for myself. If I can help someone else come to the same conclusions a bit sooner, then that is a good thing. The co-dependant in me always wants to try to reduce the distress and panic that someone else is feeling, no matter what the situation.
Take care.
Arid
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