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Post by brainjam on Sept 8, 2008 18:47:14 GMT -5
Oh mysmom, I suspect that our husbands must be related.
One time, he got hysterical over some chicken that had gone rotten in the refrigerator.
For a week.
He wouldn't throw it out and he didn't want me to throw it out.
He wanted to have a verbal fit over rotten chicken every time he opened the refrigerator door.
Finally, I threw it out.
Fortunately, that was the end of the fits over the chicken but not the fits over the "we don't have any money...we are going to be eating dog food when we retire..."
Yeah, we did the couples counseling thing.
He hated it and after several times also refused to go back.
And refused to try other counselors.
I stayed and went for several years and it did help, but not with my clutter issues.
If the animals are being neglected, then truly the only fair thing to do is to find them other homes.
As a last resort, the local aspca will (usually) come and pick the animals up.
And many aspca workers have been in places that are pretty bad-- I'm willing to bet that yours is by far not the worst place in the universe.
I've been sorting through and trashing/donating my clothes. He is not willing to do anything about his.
And with the old bad food here, every so often I take one old food item with me and throw it out.
Sometimes I have to use a garbage can down the street that has been left out for trash day.
The other day my husband had a verbal fit over his car not starting and proceeded to create a worse problem by wrenching the key out of the ignition (a 200 dollar problem).
(Dad and) I left and went out.
I have found that at times I have had to remove myself.
"I cannot talk to you when you are yelling. I am going __________ . I will be back in about (usually an hour or two)."
And then I leave.
I cannot talk reasonably with someone who has temporarily lost their reason.
And talking back loudly does not help.
If anything, I make my voice softer so he actually has to stop and listen to hear me.
Pitching a fit is less fun without an audience. (me or you and your daughter).
You are not a bad wife. You are a hoarder who married a hoarder. Me too.
As our home gets cleaner, husband has begun to get a bit more impressed. He is still not willing to give up the drawer full of hankies that he hasn't used in over thirty years.
However, the other day, he actually threw out something of his that was old/faded/useless/broken.
It is a small beginning however it is still a beginning.
You keep going on your clutter and your daughter's and perhaps your husband will gradually begin to follow along.
And even if he doesn't, you will be happier and you will be teaching your daughter better life habits.
I don't know what to do about tossing your husband's stuff without his permission.
I don't toss mines (except for old food) however we also do not have children.
Perhaps more experienced others will have suggestions based on their own experiences and successes.
Brain Jam
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Post by razy on Sept 8, 2008 19:32:49 GMT -5
My signifigant is related too!
His thing is books but he seldom throws away anything. We shifted a few months back and it was a nightmare. It took a morning to shift my stuff and more than 7 days to shift his stuff and he still can't see that he needs to get rid of things.
We have seperate bedrooms and I refuse to let him leave anything in my room. I also have talked to him about the shared space in the house, sitting room, bathroom anf kitchen and we have argeed that personal stuff can not be left lying around there. He has 2 rooms in the house that are full of his stuff (as well as the garage and the shed that are both ful to the top) I make him be responsible for his stuff. If he leaves things lyig around I gather them up and throw them into his room - if they break - I don;t care.
We have had long conversations about stuff when I have asked him to explain why he thinks that he can upset my life with his things. It has been hard and he loses it and screams and yells and breaks things but I ask him to stay calm and help me understand what he is doing. He will never admit to having a problem and would never consider counselling. The best I can do is hold him responsible for himself and his stuff, which is what he wants (I get the 'your not my mother' things too) and by asking him to explain maybe he will see himself that what he is doing is irrational and makes life hard for himself.
There has been some improvement, he has stoped buying so much junk and he does sometimes get rid of things. He told me this morning that he has 6 boxes of books to go to the auction rooms. I have been putting pressure on him to give me some space in the shed and he has no logical argument against that so he has to do something.
There are times that I think that I will have to leave him in order to move on because his stuff is just too much, too bigger burden for me to carry.
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Post by brenda on Sept 8, 2008 22:29:18 GMT -5
My husband is a low grade hoarder. He does help out quite a bit around the house but can't seem to throw anything out. He is not a big shopper by any means but if he gets an item he just won't part with it. His mother tells me to toss his stuff out when he is not home but I don't think it is wise because he has trust issues. I have been working on organizing the top floor of our home. He will dig out items of mine I have thrown out and say they are his when they are not. Tonight I asked him to please not make me feel guilty about some of the items I was tossing and not go through the items. He finds a tiny book of post its I received free from fedex. He declares they are his and takes them out of the trash. I told him if he cleaned off his desk he can have them  Anyway I don't think you can change people especially men. Brenda |
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Post by brenda on Sept 8, 2008 23:08:21 GMT -5
Charity,
Have you told him the things you just shared here? If he can't listen write him a note and give it to him.
This may sound harsh but you may have to leave him to save your daughter and yourself. Since you are at the mercy of public housing it is quite likely that if he does not change you will be evicted.
Brenda
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Post by Vivre on Sept 9, 2008 0:16:26 GMT -5
Will this help: Take pics. SHOW HIM. Maybe like many of us he really does not see it? Ask him what would happen if right now child services, your child's teacher, his boss, etc walked in? Right this second? Would you lose your little girl? Ask him, are the clothes, the birds, the mess and stress worth it??? you KNOW THEY AREN'T. Will he see? If your house were to burst into flames, what would he do? if Child protective services were driving up your driveway right now, what would he say? I know these are scary things and the attachment he feels is VERY real, i have been there, but it IS just stuff. Ask him this, if someone was taking your child, what would he be willing to give up to get her back??? I hope he can see it thaT way and realize if he won't care for these things amd leaves it to you, you have to do what you have to do to make it best for your child. If a child neglect charge were brought, it would be against anyone adult living there who let it go on, no matter whose 'fault ' it was. i know thisis hard to read, but he has to let you do what ya gotta do to make it a good place for your child. i have had to give up things i 'thought' i needed, and make it better for my family, and while i do miss certain things SOMETIMES, well, they are just things...my kids are my life. Nothing is more irreplacable then them. I know I am getting a little passionate about it but it is so hard and so overwhelming to get it and be trying to make it better and have someone undo everything you Do, not trying to be bad but just not seeing the harm they are keeping when you are trying so hard to make a better home and life. It makes you just give up. So keep at it friend.
I am pulling for you and hope all is okay where you are... i feel for your hubby but from what you have shared, he has not woken up to the reality of the situation...be safe but wake him up. i have cried and sobbed and gotten physically ill over the ame stuff... but the thought of losing my kids? Of losing the respect of the people i value? nothing is worth that. As long as i have my family, i can start over any time, anywhere. The rest is just STUFF. Valuable stuff, junk, precious items, garbage... its all stuff in the end. Your child, your hubby, yourself... you are worth MORE.
(modified to add that i saw elsewhere that you got to level one or better and prepped for inspection, so ignore alot of this, just got all ramped up over the hubby not helping you... can you tell at some point in the past i have been there done that? Not now, but then oh then... :/ anyway, i am proud of what you have accomplished! go you!!! and give that sweet girl a hug, she sounds gentle and helpful like my own lil guy ) )
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Post by lettinggo on Sept 9, 2008 2:53:30 GMT -5
I just want to say, I'm not sure why you keep apologizing, afraid that you may have offended any of us! You have the right to your frustration, and you have the right to a sane living environment.
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Post by BDG on Sept 9, 2008 12:00:19 GMT -5
Hubby and me, both have hoarding tendencies, Hubby is worse than me, I think.  He used to keep his old jeans full of holes sure that I was going to repair them the way his mother did. Nope, we argued, and while he was not looking or home really, I threw them away, one pair at a time, when he was not home. Sometimes, I would roll them up and put them in my big pocketbook when I went to the store if he was home and dump them in a garbage can somewheres. The thing is that someone who has so much junk collected, they really don't know what they have, so as long as you know the ones they really treasure and don't tell them know, they don't even notice it is gone. I finally convinced him though after awhile to let me throw his old torn clothes away, by explaining that I was not going to repair them and that it was dangerous for him to consider wearing things with holes in them to work since he works around machinery and might get his clothing caught on the machinery and get hurt, so he does not give me a hard time about it anymore, plus I never let him see me throw anything away. As for the pets, you need to let them go for health reasons, as it is not good for your health or theirs. The pet dander and especially the bird is not good for your breathing problems. Maybe you could get your Hubby to go see a counselor, the two of you together, or on his own, one on one, make sure they know he has this hoarding problem. There is a medication for this. The fact that your Hubby continually says you are not his mother makes me wonder if his mother threw something away of his, when he was a child that he treasured, and now he wants to keep everything. Of course, some people just naturally seem to have this tendency. |
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Post by heylady1 on Sept 9, 2008 18:25:12 GMT -5
I am grateful that my hubby doesn't hoard. I don't think I could handle anything else at this point!!
I don't have any advice Mysmom, other than to ask if you have showed your hubby this website and invited him to read some of the posts? If you are embarrassed by this thread you could always ask a mod to delete it before you send your hubby this way....
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Post by CourageouslyLion SeeksSerenity on Sept 9, 2008 23:13:32 GMT -5
-- I can see that your situation is becoming urgent as you are concerned about Social Services possibly visiting. I agree with the others that you need to might make some drastic choices... and SOON! - Here is something you could consider down the road ... it won't help you immediately, though. But you could consider it at some point. You and your husband might consider checking out the website "Overcoming Hoarding Together"? I can't vouch for the site, but it comes recommended. Here are a few different descriptions I've read online: - "Overcoming Hoarding Together" is for people in loving relationship to a hoarder. There is an emphasis on respect, dignity, appreciation, education, communication, honesty and boundaries for both the hoarder and oneself. It is a place to discuss and report on efforts to resolve the situation in place and is not designed as a support for those wanting to end a relationship or solve someone else's (the hoarder's) problem for them. O-H-T encourages everyone to own their own victories.
- "Overcoming Hoarding Together". For people who are in a personal relationship to others who have hoarding disorder. Giving family/friends a place to interact, normalize what they are feeling, and offer education, enlightenment, and encouragement. This group is under the guidance of a licensed marriage and family therapist. Membership is limited to adults.
- There is also a description on the site's homepage:
"O-H-T · Overcoming Hoarding Together": For people who are in a personal relationship to others who have hoarding disorder. Giving family/friends a place to interact, normalize what they are feeling, and offer education, enlightenment, and encouragement. Discussion of solutions involving manipulation or deceit, not welcome. Dehoarding is a process, not an event.
- TO CLARIFY -- that's one single website -- I merely posted several different descriptions of the same place -- "Overcoming Hoarding Together" whose URL is
health.groups.yahoo.com/group/O-H-T/.
Just an idea for the long-term view of the extended family dynamic. ----- |
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